More background info on Magnus' withdrawal from the Grand Prix
We have noted some of the comments related to Magnus' quick withdrawal from the Grand Prix.
Following an interview with the FIDE President addressing the decision process around the introduction of a new candidate tournament, we find it reasonable to provide some more background info on the withdrawal.
In the days prior to his withdrawal we discussed at lenght the uncertainty involved regarding the FIDE decision process of changing the cycle as it was clear from the wording of the regulations that the General Assembly could not change these regulations. The final decision on changes to the regulations shall be made by the FIDE Presidential Board.
Upon receiving the earlier reported response from Mr. Mastrokoukos on December 4th, I sent a reply (by e-mail) the same day containing many questions regarding the Grand Prix and the cycle change.
The two first questions were;
"Has the FIDE Presidential Board already finally decided to change the Grand Prix regulations, and if so, can you please forward the new regulations?
If such new regulations are not in place yet, could you please let us know on what basis you have announced the process of staging a bid for a 2010 Candidate tournament instead of the planned match between the GP and World Cup winners?"
Later the same day I was contacted by a senior FIDE Vice President, and I asked him some of the same questions. Below are some excerpts from the discussion we had. (The following is of course subject to my memory serving me right and also my understanding of what was said.)
His first response was that the General Assembly had decided the matter as the GA is the highest authority in FIDE. Upon my reference to the wording of the regulations he agreed that the change had not yet been administratively decided by the FIDE PB and there were no new regulations in place. The FIDE PB would anyhow follow the decision of the GA.
When asked if this meant that there were basically no regulations in effect governing the Grand Prix until the next FIDE PB meeting in March 2009, he said that if necessary this was a formality that could be handled quickly by distributing a memo on the GA-approved-change to the members of the PB for their signature.
When discussing this with Magnus afterwards we had to conclude that either the GA decision should be considered a "done deal", or we would probably not know the outcome until late March 2009. Neither of these alternatives was acceptable to Magnus, also partly due to the need to respond to other tournament invitations.
Having already missed Nanjing due to the GP Magnus definitely wanted to avoid similar occurrences in 2009.
Henrik Carlsen,
December 17th, 2008
Following an interview with the FIDE President addressing the decision process around the introduction of a new candidate tournament, we find it reasonable to provide some more background info on the withdrawal.
In the days prior to his withdrawal we discussed at lenght the uncertainty involved regarding the FIDE decision process of changing the cycle as it was clear from the wording of the regulations that the General Assembly could not change these regulations. The final decision on changes to the regulations shall be made by the FIDE Presidential Board.
Upon receiving the earlier reported response from Mr. Mastrokoukos on December 4th, I sent a reply (by e-mail) the same day containing many questions regarding the Grand Prix and the cycle change.
The two first questions were;
"Has the FIDE Presidential Board already finally decided to change the Grand Prix regulations, and if so, can you please forward the new regulations?
If such new regulations are not in place yet, could you please let us know on what basis you have announced the process of staging a bid for a 2010 Candidate tournament instead of the planned match between the GP and World Cup winners?"
Later the same day I was contacted by a senior FIDE Vice President, and I asked him some of the same questions. Below are some excerpts from the discussion we had. (The following is of course subject to my memory serving me right and also my understanding of what was said.)
His first response was that the General Assembly had decided the matter as the GA is the highest authority in FIDE. Upon my reference to the wording of the regulations he agreed that the change had not yet been administratively decided by the FIDE PB and there were no new regulations in place. The FIDE PB would anyhow follow the decision of the GA.
When asked if this meant that there were basically no regulations in effect governing the Grand Prix until the next FIDE PB meeting in March 2009, he said that if necessary this was a formality that could be handled quickly by distributing a memo on the GA-approved-change to the members of the PB for their signature.
When discussing this with Magnus afterwards we had to conclude that either the GA decision should be considered a "done deal", or we would probably not know the outcome until late March 2009. Neither of these alternatives was acceptable to Magnus, also partly due to the need to respond to other tournament invitations.
Having already missed Nanjing due to the GP Magnus definitely wanted to avoid similar occurrences in 2009.
Henrik Carlsen,
December 17th, 2008
Comments:
Posted by: Evig Optimist
Very wise. Have a nice Christmas.
Posted by: Quely
I dont know how the FIDE PB is regulated, but in other settings circulating a memo for signatures would not be a valid board decision, since this does not fill all the inherent needs, such as debate, clarifications and the possibility for alterations. This is of course without consequence, since we are talking about FIDE, who always ignore all the rules...
The decision to withdraw was sound any which way.
The decision to withdraw was sound any which way.
Posted by: Rafael Llanos.
Mr. Carlsen.
I am too lazy to read the long reasons you give that made your son withdraw from the Grand Prix. Look I am from Peru, Southamerica, poor country. I wish we could have the oportunities you (and most europeans) have to play in tournaments, now you said you withdrawn because they moved the place to Elista ?? !!
This is Rafael Llanos from Sherman Texas
Merry Christmas for you and your family and especially for Magnus.
I am too lazy to read the long reasons you give that made your son withdraw from the Grand Prix. Look I am from Peru, Southamerica, poor country. I wish we could have the oportunities you (and most europeans) have to play in tournaments, now you said you withdrawn because they moved the place to Elista ?? !!
This is Rafael Llanos from Sherman Texas
Merry Christmas for you and your family and especially for Magnus.
Posted by: Nina
Hei!
Jeg vil ønske dere en riktig God jul hele familien carlsen!!!
Jeg vil ønske dere en riktig God jul hele familien carlsen!!!
Posted by: LL
I think it honours Magnus to stick to principles and ask
for fairness. However in this world, ethics count for little.
Only politics, solid contracts and good lawyers will do.
As for FIDE, one of its main strength is drawn from exploiting
the competition and manoeuvring between the top GMs.
I'd suggest they change their motto from "Gens Una Sumus"
to "Divide and Rule".
for fairness. However in this world, ethics count for little.
Only politics, solid contracts and good lawyers will do.
As for FIDE, one of its main strength is drawn from exploiting
the competition and manoeuvring between the top GMs.
I'd suggest they change their motto from "Gens Una Sumus"
to "Divide and Rule".
Posted by: Zarathustra
RE: Rafael Lanos
We suggest you read the WHOLE reason behind the withdrawal before critizing.
Regards
Zarathustra
We suggest you read the WHOLE reason behind the withdrawal before critizing.
Regards
Zarathustra
Posted by: Gegga
Jeg ser at Magnus er avbildet med Geir Arne Drangeid ifm Aker Chess Challenge. Geir Arne var min trener da jeg begynte som sjakkspiller på barneskolen i Sandnes. :-)
Nå er det ikke sikkert det var så veldig interessant for 99,99% av de som leser dette, men jeg nevner det nå allikevel. Han er jo over middels god og over middels interessert i sjakk, kan man si!
Lykke til i kommende turneringer, og riktig God Jul til Magnus, Henrik og resten av familien Carlsen!
Nå er det ikke sikkert det var så veldig interessant for 99,99% av de som leser dette, men jeg nevner det nå allikevel. Han er jo over middels god og over middels interessert i sjakk, kan man si!
Lykke til i kommende turneringer, og riktig God Jul til Magnus, Henrik og resten av familien Carlsen!
Posted by: Henrik C.
Quely,
thank you for the insights. The way the new FIDE proposal was raised in Dresden as well as communicated afterwards lacks credibility. It is interesting to see that compared to what I was told on the phone by Makropoulos, the FIDE president in the interview in Elista isn't as clear on whether the PB has to make a decision in line with the GA approved solution of a Candidate tournament.
Rafael Llanos,
thank you for your support. I understand that the explanation I wrote may be somewhat boring, but in general you have to work on your laziness to make progress in life:-)
NIna,
God Jul og Godt Nytt År til deg og dine også!
LL,
thank you. I agree that the main challenge related to the participation in FIDE events is the lack of mutually binding unbiased contracts.
Zarathustra,
thank you for you support, we know we can count on you!
Gegga,
takk for informasjonen! Geir Arne spilte et parti med Magnus og viste at dette har han gjort mange ganger før! Som Brekke kommenterte etter en 5-6 trekk; dere følger fortsatt partier fra tidligere VM-matcher:-)
Merry Christmas!
Henrik C.
thank you for the insights. The way the new FIDE proposal was raised in Dresden as well as communicated afterwards lacks credibility. It is interesting to see that compared to what I was told on the phone by Makropoulos, the FIDE president in the interview in Elista isn't as clear on whether the PB has to make a decision in line with the GA approved solution of a Candidate tournament.
Rafael Llanos,
thank you for your support. I understand that the explanation I wrote may be somewhat boring, but in general you have to work on your laziness to make progress in life:-)
NIna,
God Jul og Godt Nytt År til deg og dine også!
LL,
thank you. I agree that the main challenge related to the participation in FIDE events is the lack of mutually binding unbiased contracts.
Zarathustra,
thank you for you support, we know we can count on you!
Gegga,
takk for informasjonen! Geir Arne spilte et parti med Magnus og viste at dette har han gjort mange ganger før! Som Brekke kommenterte etter en 5-6 trekk; dere følger fortsatt partier fra tidligere VM-matcher:-)
Merry Christmas!
Henrik C.
Posted by: Gegga
Hvordan gikk partiet, Henrik? Regner med at Geir Arne ga seg etter ca 25-30 trekk?
Posted by: Alexandru
Henrik,
I totally agree that the way this FIDE proposal was raised in Dresden and communicated afterwards lacks any kind of credibility. It was great to see how some top players, starting with Magnus, have reacted to it.
At the same time, it is not surprising to see how FIDE leadership continues to behave. The fact that they tell you something on the phone and then they change it on that interview doesn't seem to bother them.
Merry Christmas!
Alexandru
I totally agree that the way this FIDE proposal was raised in Dresden and communicated afterwards lacks any kind of credibility. It was great to see how some top players, starting with Magnus, have reacted to it.
At the same time, it is not surprising to see how FIDE leadership continues to behave. The fact that they tell you something on the phone and then they change it on that interview doesn't seem to bother them.
Merry Christmas!
Alexandru
Posted by: Rolfo
God jul! / Merry Christmas!
Rolfo
Rolfo
Posted by: Mark
Dear Henrik et al:
Can someone tell me, to this day, how many GMs have withdrawn from the latest and future Grand Prix events over
these recent FIDE developments?
I agree with the decision
of Magnus 100%, but many, many more players need to do
this same thing if FIDE is ever going to understand that they
can't play around with the GMs any way they like.
How can the chess world begin a TRUE GUILD OR UNION for GMs, one that FIDE cannot brush aside?
happy Holidays!
Mark in American Samoa
Can someone tell me, to this day, how many GMs have withdrawn from the latest and future Grand Prix events over
these recent FIDE developments?
I agree with the decision
of Magnus 100%, but many, many more players need to do
this same thing if FIDE is ever going to understand that they
can't play around with the GMs any way they like.
How can the chess world begin a TRUE GUILD OR UNION for GMs, one that FIDE cannot brush aside?
happy Holidays!
Mark in American Samoa
Posted by: Daniel
Kudos to Magnus and happy holidays to you Henrik and Magnus.
Posted by:
Is this a true story?
www.chessgames.com/perl/chessplayer?pid=52948&kpage=518
May-26-07
Young Sun: I would like to share this story with you:
***
I knew that according to the blog of his father, they were going to leave Norway by plane on Friday morning. Since I had the day off, I went to Gardermoen (Norway's main airport) to see if I could get a glimpse of him. I went through the security control and waited for them in front of the bookstore, where people arrive after the security control.
I was hoping they would not enter the international departure zone immediately after security, because I had no ticket and could not enter there myself (but you can easily go through security without a ticket). After 90 minutes of waiting, they arrived.
He carried a bag. I suppose it contained his computer. Luckily, they went into the bookstore and I saw his father picking up the Norwegian translation of Richard Dawkins' "The God Delusion", while "my target" went straight for the comics and picked up a new Donald Duck pocket (paperback).
I picked up an english issue of Carl Bark's classic Uncle Scrooge and asked him (in Norwegian of course, translated to english here) whether he preferred the American Donald Duck and Uncle Scrooge classics or the new Italian produced Donald Duck series. He looked at me briefly and answered: "I like both". I asked him: "The Italian version is kind of hypermodern, don't you think?"
His face looked like a question mark, and I could see he was not comfortable talking with me. "Like 1. b3 in chess", I continued. His face changed character, his eyes searched for his father, and then he left the bookstore. "Let's go", he said to his father.
I followed them. I was not thinking clearly so I tried the clumsy: "You can still play that opening". The father was calm, while the son was upset.
A few metres from the international zone's ticket control he stopped and gave the bag to his father. He took his right hand in his pocket, turned around and looked at me. I stopped and felt paralyzed. "Look", he said, "take this!". A handful of raisins hit my face. The ticket controllers smiled at me while they controlled the tickets. The father looked disappointed and kind of angry at his son. I felt strange.
I went back to the bookstore and bought "Hurin's children" by Tolkien, found myself a table and tried to relax. After reading a few pages I was thinking: "Who knows what the results will be of today's encounter? I guess we will see in a few days...".
***
www.chessgames.com/perl/chessplayer?pid=52948&kpage=518
May-26-07
Young Sun: I would like to share this story with you:
***
I knew that according to the blog of his father, they were going to leave Norway by plane on Friday morning. Since I had the day off, I went to Gardermoen (Norway's main airport) to see if I could get a glimpse of him. I went through the security control and waited for them in front of the bookstore, where people arrive after the security control.
I was hoping they would not enter the international departure zone immediately after security, because I had no ticket and could not enter there myself (but you can easily go through security without a ticket). After 90 minutes of waiting, they arrived.
He carried a bag. I suppose it contained his computer. Luckily, they went into the bookstore and I saw his father picking up the Norwegian translation of Richard Dawkins' "The God Delusion", while "my target" went straight for the comics and picked up a new Donald Duck pocket (paperback).
I picked up an english issue of Carl Bark's classic Uncle Scrooge and asked him (in Norwegian of course, translated to english here) whether he preferred the American Donald Duck and Uncle Scrooge classics or the new Italian produced Donald Duck series. He looked at me briefly and answered: "I like both". I asked him: "The Italian version is kind of hypermodern, don't you think?"
His face looked like a question mark, and I could see he was not comfortable talking with me. "Like 1. b3 in chess", I continued. His face changed character, his eyes searched for his father, and then he left the bookstore. "Let's go", he said to his father.
I followed them. I was not thinking clearly so I tried the clumsy: "You can still play that opening". The father was calm, while the son was upset.
A few metres from the international zone's ticket control he stopped and gave the bag to his father. He took his right hand in his pocket, turned around and looked at me. I stopped and felt paralyzed. "Look", he said, "take this!". A handful of raisins hit my face. The ticket controllers smiled at me while they controlled the tickets. The father looked disappointed and kind of angry at his son. I felt strange.
I went back to the bookstore and bought "Hurin's children" by Tolkien, found myself a table and tried to relax. After reading a few pages I was thinking: "Who knows what the results will be of today's encounter? I guess we will see in a few days...".
***
Posted by: Bobby F.
Of course it's true.
Aliens visiting Earth in UFO's are true too. Just ask the President of FIDE . (Check out the above link to article in Spiegel).
http://www.spiegel.de/international/spiegel/0,1518,442158,00.html
Aliens visiting Earth in UFO's are true too. Just ask the President of FIDE . (Check out the above link to article in Spiegel).
http://www.spiegel.de/international/spiegel/0,1518,442158,00.html
Posted by: Tommy
I condemn the behavior of the person who pursued Magnus.
His behavior was unforgiveable.
Leave people alone.
Give Magnus the freedom to live his life without being bothered by ever tom dick and harry.
I doubt the story is true but if true the guy was lucky to only get a few raisins.
he deserved to be arrested for harrassment and stalking.
His behavior was unforgiveable.
Leave people alone.
Give Magnus the freedom to live his life without being bothered by ever tom dick and harry.
I doubt the story is true but if true the guy was lucky to only get a few raisins.
he deserved to be arrested for harrassment and stalking.
Posted by: Roger
Hi Henrik,
I have just read an article by Y. Vasiliev about the phone conference held yesterday between FIDE management and key chess players.
chesspro.ru/_events/2008/vasiliev.html (in russian)
I know you were participating in the conference on behalf of Magnus. I would like to give you some feedback (as a member of general public or, I'd better say, as one of chess fans), but I wanted to see your comments on the discussion first. Are you planning to cover this event in your blog?
Best regards,
Serge
I have just read an article by Y. Vasiliev about the phone conference held yesterday between FIDE management and key chess players.
chesspro.ru/_events/2008/vasiliev.html (in russian)
I know you were participating in the conference on behalf of Magnus. I would like to give you some feedback (as a member of general public or, I'd better say, as one of chess fans), but I wanted to see your comments on the discussion first. Are you planning to cover this event in your blog?
Best regards,
Serge
Posted by: Henrik C.
All,
thank you for the feedback and good wishes:-)
The story from chessgames is a nice piece of fiction.
Serge,
I'm planning to cover the event in the blog. We are waiting for a few days to give FIDE the chance to publish it all first which is something they have promissed to do.
Henrik
thank you for the feedback and good wishes:-)
The story from chessgames is a nice piece of fiction.
Serge,
I'm planning to cover the event in the blog. We are waiting for a few days to give FIDE the chance to publish it all first which is something they have promissed to do.
Henrik
Posted by: LE
Yes, seems very fictional. Anyway, doesn't really matter, the story claims very rude stalking and actually sort of a fitting response...
The tournament schedule needs to be updated, btw.
Thanks for a good blog.
The tournament schedule needs to be updated, btw.
Thanks for a good blog.
Posted by: peter
Hi Henrik, could you drop me an email, I need to ask you something.
Cheers,
Peter
Cheers,
Peter
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